“你团队中的每个人都有不同的个性和不同的动力。作为领导者，我们的工作是要了解的是，有助于鼓励他们为改善自己以及你的组织来做最终极的最佳工作。“- Ryan Hawk.
我们与Ryan Hawk发言，作者欢迎来管理层和播客主机“学习领袖秀。“瑞安与我们股份股份，他的使命分享卓越的领导人的共同性，并通过他的写作和播客互动和激励数百万。瑞安认为自己是领导力的终身学生，他与我们共同与我们在日常领导力的努力中融入同情和同情的深度，无论是我们个人或专业的生活。
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成绩单
本集由Untold Content 's赞助播出乐动体育足球创新故事乐动体育266。在这种沉浸式和互动的故事驱动的经验中增加购买。您的团队在哪个讲故事技术的最新项目，原型和投票 - 并通过25个史诗般的创新故事的史诗例子来启发。
凯蒂·泰勒(00:00:04)欢迎来到未罗革说的创新故事，在那里我们扩大了不带无国外内容的洞察力，影响和创新的解放故事。乐动体育足球我是你的主人，凯蒂泰勒。我们的客人今天是瑞安鹰。他是一个主题演讲者，顾问和新书的作者欢迎来管理。他也是学习领袖的主人，这是一个由Inc杂志的五个播客列表命名的播客，以使您成为一个更聪明的领导者。他也是布鲁克斯的头。他欣赏领导咨询惯例。瑞安，我很高兴能够在播客上得到你。谢谢你在这里。
Ryan Hawk.[00:00:42]凯蒂，我很高兴来到这里。我很感激你让我为你做的好事感到兴奋。
凯蒂·泰勒[00:00:47]是的。我想，你知道，我们大约一年前认识，我了解了更多。我听你播客的时间比那还长。但我们要更多地了解你的一些主题演讲和你主持的一些研讨会。所以请告诉我们更多关于你对领导的热情以及为什么这是点燃你激情的东西。
Ryan Hawk.[00:01:08]好吧，我会为我说，这是因为主要是，我很幸运能从一个非常年轻的时代的令人难以置信的领导者领导，从我的妈妈和爸爸开始。而且他们仍然这样做，以及我生命中的两个特定教练在高中的高中演奏了我的足球教练的领导力，鲍勃，格雷格和罗恩，我首先真正了解到了领导力的权力和价值。看到那两个家伙用他们的力量让我真正激励我试图在我长大和成熟时对别人产生类似的影响。所以一旦我离开了运动运动并过渡到商业世界，我想看看是否有一种方法可以对别人有这种影响。因此，这就是为什么我对研究出色的领导力，然后试图自己练习才能帮助别人来帮助他人。And that’s that is a big reason why my podcast of learning leadership exists and has for the past five years is because that’s what I’m truly most passionate about, whether it’s leading in the business world or even more importantly, leading my household as a husband and a dad. And it really translates into all worlds. And that’s why I love it so much.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:02:31]真不可思议，不是吗，有时候我们生活中最不起眼的人会变成最有影响力的人?
Ryan Hawk.[00:02:38]这是真的。它真的是。而且我必须觉得第一手。所以我希望现在对他人做同样的事情。而且我认为就像你一样，它很令人兴奋。它充实。它很满意。它亮起你。而且我认为这是对所有这些的有趣部分。
凯蒂·泰勒[00:02:58]所以我们将在一点点谈论创新，特别是在一起谈论创新。但首先，我想从领导力的概念及其与讲故事的关系开始。你可以分享你的一些想法，因为有人进入领导力的境界吗？
Ryan Hawk.[00:03:15]我想到了我最喜欢的老板之一。他实际上是我老板的老板，所以我没有直接为他工作。但他的名字是布莱恩·米勒。我认为布莱恩如此高效的原因之一是他总是在我们每次会议或我们的或我们的市政厅开始时用一个故事。这个故事通常是在他收集知识的过程中得到的，无论是阅读书籍、文章还是观看TED演讲。他会讲一个故事，让我们这么说吧，就好像我记得一个高尔夫球手，一个叫韦伯·辛普森的高尔夫球手。布莱恩告诉我们韦伯是如何从一个赛季到下一个赛季只增加了半杆的得分。然后他展示了他在前100名高尔夫球手中排名的不同。他和他都取得了巨大的进步仅仅因为那个简单的半程进步。然后他把它和我们的世界联系起来。 At this time, I was a sales professional. He was able to relate that then to our world and how we could implement some of the same behaviors that Webb Simpson did on the golf course, but then do it in the world of professional selling. And at that point, I realized that Brian had this magic skill to go out and be a consumer of knowledge, distill that knowledge in those stories down to its essence, retell them to all of us, and最重要的是，创建一些实际应用程序。所以我们会记住这个故事。然后我们还记得如何将他讲的故事应用到我们的日常生活中。所以他没有站在那里分享上季度的数据和未来季度的数据并说我们必须实现这个目标，他找到了一种从现实生活中提取的方法。我还记得这是十年前的事了。现在,凯蒂很疯狂,我仍记得那个特定的故事以及它如何影响我,所以当我看到一个家伙喜欢布莱恩·米勒这样做,我想我需要工作和发展同样能够讲故事的技巧,然后联系他们,我领导的人。
凯蒂泰勒[00:05:31]是的，我认为这是真的，不是吗？我生命中的每一个真正强大的导师，你知道，真正的伟大的老板或导师都有能力讲述能够帮助我与他们在他们生活中的生活中的那个时间相关的故事的能力和我面临的这样一个挑战。当人类可以这样做时，它是强大的，当我们可以像这样相互连接。然而，我们对我们很多人来说都是真的挑战。我认为，这几乎就像一个勇敢的勇敢，我认为，对于很多人来说，很多人都在我们脑海中的商店故事。
Ryan Hawk.(00:06:09)作为一个专业的讲故事人，你是怎么做的?比如，你是否有一个适当的过程，拥有一个故事银行，并知道何时进入银行并把它们取出来，无论是书面的文字还是口头的?你有吗?我对此很好奇，因为我一直在努力做得更好。
凯蒂·泰勒(00:06:28)是的,当然。重复很重要，但倾听也很重要，并且能够根据不同听众和利益相关者的反馈来调整你的故事。我认为最好的策略之一来自古希腊，在那里演说就是一切。所以你们要原谅我有点书呆子气。这是我的城市。我们开始吧。让我们回到研究生时代。在那个文化中，演讲就是一切。他们甚至没有文字。所以当时操作员会使用的一个策略是他们进入一个建筑或空间，他们会用不同的台词或剧本，在建筑的不同部分讲述他们的故事。 And so you’d stand in one corner and look at the environment. You kind of get a visual for where that space looked like. There might be something hanging on the wall. There might be a cup in the corner. Right. And you would sort of see those objects and you would speak the first few lines. Then you would physically move to a different part of the room and you’d be looking at a different你会看着一个座位，例如，你会说出接下来的几句话，然后你会在整个建筑中移动，不同的层次，不同的楼层，不同的物体。这样你就能记住整个演讲了。哇。是的。所以他们非常尊重帮助我们记忆的空间和视觉线索。我喜欢用这个。我想这是一个有趣的实用技巧，试着练习在不同的空间说不同的句子或不同的故事，这样你就可以创造一种模式。这是一种回忆的方式，当你在讲故事的时候，你会回忆说这些话的时候你在哪里。
Ryan Hawk.(00:08:23)而且我只是觉得它回到后，它不一定是性感的，但重复对练习，排练，连续地互相做出了这么重要。而且我知道我准备和当我没有时的排练时之间的区别。这很明显。是的。即使我也是我已经给出了一个主题演讲，那将是一个类似的消息一百次。I still know I’m going to be better on that stage in front of all of those people if I’m in my hotel room doing, practicing, getting the reps, telling the stories, using emotion, understanding the highs and lows of your voice, a reading the audience like, which is hard to do on your own, but it’s put it’s being mindful that I just find that I take that from the sporting world, too. Is that the value of being overly prepared for the moment so that when you do get on stage or something may happen that was unexpected, you’re prepared because you’ve got your material down cold and that comes from proper preparation.
凯蒂·泰勒(00:09:27)是的，是的，是的。我很欣赏运动隐喻，因为在这里甚至在这里迈出一步，那时候运营商也会去这些学校，他们的田径运动就像艺术艺术一样重要。因此，他们会从摔跤到他们的下一项活动，这将是言语的练习。因此，真正的伤害和你的物理环境和肌肉记忆是深受理解和感觉到的事情。我认为这很重要。你知道，我们现在有很多技术工具来帮助我们记住，写作。我们可以写下东西。有纸质，有电脑，计算机，有文字。如果你是一个可视人能够解决这些词语，有些人，你知道，记住和真正通过如何通过创造不同以不同的方式说出事物。Variations of your talking points on the text screen, right, and and for some of us, it’s really about coming up with visual cues, but I completely agree with what you’re saying, that it is about muscle memory and getting those reps and matters.
Ryan Hawk.[00:10:33]是的，毫无疑问。毫无疑问。我认为这就像你要做的事情，如果对你很重要，然后获得重复并导致它，因为这已经过度准备了。没有缺点。我的意思是，真的没有。无论是播客，这是一个讲话，它在写作。正确的。这就是为什么作家必须每天写一天，而不仅仅是哦，我有一个写作项目，现在是时候开始写作了。就像，不，那就是我的常规例程的一部分是我是作家。所以我必须每天写一次。 And I think all of those reps matter.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:11:03]对，就是这样。你知道，别的东西，我认为这真的很重要，就像我们对故事一样重要，就是能够同情许多不同的观点和声音。开始讲述不仅仅是你的故事，这是一个非常好的习惯。所以能够说，这是我从我们的运营头脑中听到的事情，或者是我所知道的，你知道，客户服务代表，这是她对它的看法。And creating really, I think, being able to increase diversity and inclusion by by giving voice to the perspectives of people who aren’t only going to use cultural references that are the same as yours or because, you know, that’s how we that’s how we change organizational cultures and make sure that there’s not sort of just only the same types of metaphors or references getting circulated, which can kind of inadvertently make people who might feel outside of that, you know, racial or gender identity or cultural reference feel excluded. And sometimes that’s not intentional, but it can happen. And so I think using our power of storytelling to lend voice to others and or to invite others, especially when you’re in a leadership position, to open up in a way that aligns with the values that you want to spread. Right. Or that aligns with the mission that you’re trying to lead against, but inviting other voices onto that stage with you and really giving the opportunity for diversity to be a habit, something that’s completely saturated, if you will, throughout your organization.
Ryan Hawk.[00:12:45]当然。它也可能为您创造了更大的视角，因为您将自己放在那个人的鞋子，以及同情和同情的领导者，这是有效领导者的两个伟大品质。因此，如果你养成习惯努力讲述其他人的故事或其他人或从他们的角度来思考它，我再也看不到了，我只看到了众所周境并定期把自己放在那个位置。
凯蒂泰勒[00:13:11]是的，我喜欢那个点。是的。真的，同理心是另一个关于获得代表的谈话，它真的是关于练习和每天提醒自己，就像我的意见，而不是我的声音和我的力量的唯一一个可以用来举起他人。正确的。嗯是的。是啊。好东西。所以告诉我更多关于你的新书，欢迎来管理层。
Ryan Hawk.[00:13:36]嗯，这真的是为我自己写的，因为我记得我从个人贡献者到管理者的飞跃。我想，尤其是我在美国公司的时候，这是一个巨大的飞跃，我没有做好准备。事实上，大多数人都是这样，因为你太专注于在你当前的角色上表现出色，至少我是这样。我想我应该为我自己说话，但我看到其他人处理过这个问题你专注于那个。但后来你意识到，因为你在这方面做得很好，这给了你面试这些更重要的领导职位的机会，比如经理。然而，作为一个成功的个体贡献者所需要的技能和成功领导他人所需要的技能，很少是相同的。所以你会因为过去的工作而得到晋升。这和你将来要做的工作没有太大关系。所以你还没准备好。我写了我第一次飞跃时需要的书，因为不幸的是，我是一个糟糕的老板，糟糕的经理，我最初的专业人士有一段时间必须与之打交道，并没有真正完全了解我在做什么。 I had a great boss, but he also had a lot going on. And so I needed to figure some things out and I could have used some sort of manual or a guide in order to help me do that better. And so I tried to write that guide now that many years have passed. And I’ve also spoken with more than 350 of the most thoughtful leaders and borrowed some of their wisdom, mashed it together with my experience and my learnings and then and then produced it in a 60 thousand plus word book. And so that’s my hope is, Katie, that literally every person who gets promoted from that individual contributor to manager role gets a big congratulations, Pat, on the back and handed this book. Yes. That could help them do a much better job than I did when I first got promoted.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:15:48]我喜欢你的个人故事，你把它和激发你写这本书的原因联系在一起，并把这些主题和你创作的所有内容联系在一起。而且，你知道，这本书适用于所有的商业部门，所有的商业规模和在这些职位上的个人。丽卡的管理涵盖了职业发展的方方面面。但我想特别对创业界说一点，因为在创业界，管理是一种东西，当创业界发生变化，开始获得动力，开始增长，开始招聘时，管理就会迅速发挥作用。有时这些公司会经历300% 500%或800%的年增长率。他们也应该是那些一开始就有想法的人在一个三、四、五个人的小团队里工作，个人的贡献就是一切。这就是你所需要的，一旦你开始迅速扩大规模，就需要有一个不同的身份作为管理者和领导者，这种转变对于高增长的初创公司来说是非常迅速的。你能和我谈谈吗，我是说，就我个人而言，作为一个创业公司的创始人，这是我经历过的事情，我相信我会继续从中学习。现在，我正试图指导其他的人，你知道，我的下一群人，你知道，公司里的人开始把自己当成经理和领导者，这样我们才能继续扩大规模。对于这四家初创公司来说，扩大规模非常关键，我们公司的员工都把自己视为管理者。 And it’s a way of positioning those startups to dream bigger. Hmm.
Ryan Hawk.(00:17:40)是的，我认为这是一个很大的挑战，因为你只是从现在的工作中迈出了现在的工作，以领导别人做这项工作。And so your job is just a dramatic change as a dramatic transition that sometimes isn’t it’s not always timed properly or maybe you don’t necessarily want to, but in order for the business to grow and be successful, that’s what needs to happen. And so that’s why I think it’s it’s a worthy cause to study and understand how to be an effective leader, how to understand, to inspire people and empower people to do their ultimate best work and how and also the fact that each and every person on your team, Katie, has a different personality, has a different motivation internally. They have a different for why they’re doing what they do. And as the leader, it is our job to understand what that is, to help unleash those people, to do their ultimate best work for the betterment of both themselves as well as your organization, your company. And that takes a lot of time. That takes effort, that takes careful thought, it takes reflection. And most importantly, it takes you deliberately caring deeply about each of those people because they certainly don’t care how much you know, unless they know that you care. And I found that putting all of that together is much easier said than done. The execution of all of that is a daily battle in order to stay on top of it and to lead with trust, which is the foundation of all relationships. And in doing that, though, as hard as you’re trying to think of a top line business, see type terms as well as you have to combine that with leading actual people. And that’s that’s the challenge of doing what you do.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:19:42]我认为这是非常令人难以置信的真实，对此过渡。这是一个奇怪的心态转移，在你可能被奖励之前，你可能会奖励自己，你知道，你的头脑里面的积极内部消息。而且，在从客户或投资者开始的初创企业或者从投资者那里出发，你就是做好工作。你匆匆忙忙，对吗？就像你在这里做的工作一样，切他和从中转换到。缩放你刚刚进入一个可以是可靠的或能够支持其他个人运行流程或使他们的创造力的过程中的进程，这是一种如此不同的心态。I’m really grateful that you’ve written this book because it seems it’s really helping us pay attention to how strange of a shift that really is for so many people, especially when we reward ourselves and are rewarded in companies for being able to do the work really, really well by ourselves. And that’s oftentimes the reason why someone gets identified for a management promotion. Right. But then ironically, it’s also the challenge of sort of getting out of that mindset and saying, oh, now it’s my job to empower other people and help them get the recognition and the reward for the hard work.
Ryan Hawk.[00:21:12]这是完全正确的。当你在现在的岗位上转变时你感觉如何?怎么样了?
凯蒂·泰勒(00:21:22)哦，谢谢关心。你知道，我想如果我回头看乐动体育足球如果我从一开始就没有成为领导者的激情，就不会有今天的公司。你知道，我一开始是做研究教授，然后开始做兼职顾问，那就是我自己独立工作。幸运的是，我有一些令人难以置信的导师，特别是，他们是我与退伍军人事务部的一个分包合同的主要政府供应商。她对我说，你知道吗，凯蒂，你的合同上没有规定你必须一个人做这一切。你可以雇人或者分包给其他人来帮助你达到他们要求的范围。同时也要保持你的研究日程和教学进度。我想，这太棒了。我可以衡量自己。这是惊人的。和正确的。 So in startup speak that that’s the that’s a huge mindset shift to at least for me at the time. Right. It was sort of more in the professional services, you know, kind of definition, I guess, of a startup. But and that’s shifted for untold as we start to dream quite, quite bigger. But I know that in the beginning it was it just became very important to me as I realized how much more was possible if I could create jobs for people, if I could create opportunities and we could reach more clients that way, we could really help accomplish this, this broader mission of being able to translate technical information and ways that all people can understand it, just that a larger vision came into play. And the way it’s going for me now is that I’m in a new role as we’ve scaled quite a bit over the last, you know, since our founding three years ago. And now I’m running a team of about seven and helping them think with with that kind of mindset is my current job as a leader so that we don’t limit ourselves and also to identifying and really, again, to to what you said, which is helping people identify their strengths and their desires professionally, you know, so sort of understanding the value of people who are doing the work. You know, for us, that’s really high level research, writing and content creation. And we work with highly complex subject matter. And so, you know, in technical, scientific, medical fields and so really deeply respecting the work that’s being done at the content level, at the research level, and not forcing everyone on the team to need to scale themselves if that’s not their professional trajectory, but also balancing that with the vision to scale this this organization and the belief that with processes and practices and with really strong management, we can, in fact scale much more rapidly and be able to create even more jobs for more people and get, you know, be able to to work with with more innovative organizations to support them and therefore accomplish our bigger mission. So I’m in an interesting position now of trying to really coach others potential. You know, people who, you know, in a startup, we sort of have this interesting choice, especially when we’re not at this point yet, we don’t have the pressure of investors yet have to force to scale. And so there’s sort of this, like, ability to decide how fast or slow we want to go. And that can be a point of tension, too. So it’s super different in the startup world in deciding at what point to bring in. You know, larger investors and that sort of thing, and but I’m a very sort of empathy led leader and so thinking and really letting this company grow based on, to some degree, the talented people who make it and their visions to combining our visions together and building something that I could never have imagined on my own. Right.
Ryan Hawk.[00:25:41]Do you do I mean, I’m fascinated by the kind of like what you do when it comes to your business development slash sales process, like how much how much of your selling or acquiring new clients happens because of you and your team’s ability to tell stories, to tell effective stories? I would say 100 percent that I go like, what does it sound like? I’m fascinated by that.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:26:13]是的。所以，你知道，就像所有有效的讲故事和销售一样，它真的是满足客户的需求，潜在的客户，你正在谈到。所以，你知道，它变化。当然，我们必须有点不同的谈话点，取决于，您知道，我们所谈论的哪种类型的客户是唯一的。我们在不罗德的最大故事是您的组织专家们，他们的见解是在实验室长凳或患者的床边留下的。这些人没有足够的思想领导范围内容没有足够的思想领导。而且如果您希望在您的公共存在方面更具创新，并且您的客户或消费者了解您的品牌的方式，那么您真的需要利用您的专家的见解。与此同时，对于许多专家来说真的很难分享他们的研究和他们的数据，这是对别人有意义的方式。正确的。And so we’ve worked for a long time with engineers and product designers and scientists and medical providers to help sort of create a bridge between research and development and some of those more subject matter expertise areas of organizations to translate what those individuals know and their insights to the sales and marketing team so that they can leverage that in conversations and and help produce thought leading content. That’s, you know, evidence based content. That’s a lot of what, you know, we do. And there’s so much need for that, especially as there’s more especially there’s, you know, increased transparency is a demand from consumers. And more and more leaders are feeling pressure to make sure that they are communicating thought leadership and articulating the fact that they are, in fact, innovative and they know the trends and they’re on top of their game. And so not really. I think there’s just this dual pressure now in a way that is more as a higher demand than ever, where you don’t just have to be great at the work and leading the work. You also have to show thought, leadership and project that identity inside your organization and beyond makes so much sense.
Ryan Hawk.[00:28:35]我很乐意听。谢谢你的回答。很感激。我应该练习一下我的五秒版本。我爱它。那很酷。那很酷。我的意思是，它不是它不是真的没有没有五秒钟的答案，所以我喜欢它。
凯蒂·泰勒[00:28:50]是的,谢谢你。太感谢了，太感谢了哦，天哪，我不敢相信我们只剩下一分钟了，就这么过去了。但是，你知道，告诉我，你认为讲故事的重要性是什么，尤其是对创新或者对鼓励我们展望未来的公司来说?
Ryan Hawk.[00:29:11]嗯，我的意思是，我认为这是最有效的工具之一，以推动人们。真正的创新就是做出改变，有效地把人从一个地方带到另一个地方。如果你能有效地讲出来，以故事的形式讲出来你是否会把它叫做领导层的变革管理之类的。但我发现，如果你回顾历史，我的意思是，肯尼迪总统，在赖斯大学发表的登月演说。正确的。比如他讲了一个多么有效的故事，以及故事背后的原因。有无数这样的例子改变了很多人的生活。领导者有能力做到这一点，如果他们学习并理解讲故事的意义。这真的能激发创新。它可以激发变革。 It can inspire people to move. Also, as a leader, storytelling can build confidence. And the people that you are leading, it shows that you are a thoughtful person, that you’ve done some deliberate work in trying to understand what the future holds or what are people most scared of. They’re scared of uncertainty. And so leaders who can tell effective stories about what they want and see and think will happen moving forward, have the ability to to excite and inspire people. And I remember talking to Marcus Buckingham about this. He’s like the leaders I want to follow and see around the corners. So what do you mean by that? Well, they’ve done the necessary work that I’m not going to say that they can predict the future, but they have a way about them that builds confidence that they have. They seem to have a better understanding of what may happen moving forward than those who don’t. And that’s why I went up when I’m asked what are qualities of effective leadership, I think being extremely thoughtful, reflecting, really understanding what’s happening and then being very intentional. And I think storytelling plays a role. And both of those are really thinking things through at a deep level and then being intentional with your actions following that careful thought and being intentional about the story that you are crafting for yourself as well as for the people that you’re leading, will make a massive difference in the success or failure of your team, of your company, of your business. And so that’s why it’s important for all of us as leaders to really think about that and be intentional in how we’re crafting that narrative for ourselves and our teams.
凯蒂·泰勒(00:31:47)这完全正确。我喜欢你强调反思和深度考虑和思想的重要性，你知道，一旦领导者已经确定了一个重要信息或一个重要的故事来分享，你的思想是什么可以沟通的最佳方式？您认为领导者应该为自己和交付故事而建立什么目标？
Ryan Hawk.[00:32:13]我是说，我们可能都见过一些模特。我给大家讲个小故事。但我记得当我把我的书的早期草稿寄给播客上的一些非常好的作者时，他们提供了一些非常有帮助的反馈。我记得特别清楚的是一个叫瑞安·霍利迪的人，他是一个很棒的作家写了很多书，包括障碍是自我的方式是敌人和其他人的方式。而Ryan足够尊重提供反馈。我寄给他一本书的早期草案。他说，我记得作为一封电子邮件，然后我们有一个后续电话。他说，你在做什么？第四十三页的故事应该在第一页。你必须抓住喉咙，让他们想要继续翻页。那是什么，这是一个非常严酷的类比或隐喻。但他真正意味着你有这个伟大的故事，你在中间埋葬。你应该在你的书中打开这个故事。 It’ll it’ll it’ll help people turn the page. And what that tells me is when I am giving a keynote or writing a piece, don’t be afraid to lead off with a compelling story that will make them really perk up and want to wait for the next word. Because really, what are you doing as a speaker? You’re just trying to earn the right to have your audience’s attention. For the next few minutes, and so my keynotes, whether they might be an hour long, but I’m trying to earn the right every few minutes to hold their attention for a few more minutes. When I’m writing a book, I’m trying to earn the right for that reader to turn the page to go to the next one and want to continue turning pages. And so as from a storytelling perspective, that’s what it’s all about. If I understand the dynamics behind telling an effective story that makes people want to continue listening to my speeches or read my book or listen to my podcast, that’s what I have to do. And so I think having a hook, having something that maybe is a bit surprising to kick it off is one way to to understand the power of the beginnings of things. And I always try to think of, all right, let me let me get to the beginnings of things on a regular basis where I’m grabbing attention and then and then having the dynamics of storytelling play itself out through the course of either speaking or writing that. And that’s one memorable story in my life that has had an impact on me that I’ve tried to implement on a daily basis.
凯蒂·泰勒[00:35:01]我喜欢这种建议。这是令人难以置信。是的，有一种称为超现实地位效应的东西。这让我想起了你的建议让我想起了它。It’s the idea that people will better remember the first thing they hear and the last thing they hear and the words in the middle, I kind of get lost, but you’ve really got to hook and create something lasting and memorable at the start and the finish.
Ryan Hawk.[00:35:26]是的，我同意，然后很明显会有冲突，你需要激发情感的神经我认为你需要在这个过程中有一些惊喜。有时候说，哦，等等，还有。正确的。然后有一个令人满意的结局。我认为这就是故事的动力。但首先要理解这样一个事实的力量，这就像你在做主旨演讲一样，我很早就从演讲教练那里学到了这一点。所以我很幸运我做了。我通常会走上去说，哦，我很兴奋能来这里。非常感谢你们邀请我。这太浪费了。 You’re wasting such precious moments when you have all of their attention and you immediately just let them down by not having any type of surprise, no hook, nothing. You’re just saying, oh, thanks so much. This is so great. What a good venue it is when you should go boom right into the story or right into the moment immediately so that they’re like, wow, this is different. I got a perk up, I’m ready to go. And then from there you take off. But I don’t like wandering into a speech if I’m going to go and I’ve learned this the hard way by making mistakes. But whether you’re leading your team’s meeting on Monday morning coming up or you’re giving a keynote in front of thousands of people or you’re writing a book, don’t wander into it. Understand that that first initial moment is so important. It’s so vital. Don’t waste it. And most people do, but don’t waste it. Don’t wander and just go in like, OK, if you were writing, just delete the first paragraph and start with the second paragraph. Yes. Write like that’s that’s one way I think of it. OK, I’m just going to get rid of that part. Yeah. Yeah. It’s, it’s much easier said than done though. We all have made those mistakes and we’ll make them in the future. But, but, but that’s something to really be cognizant of when you’re, when you’re in the mode of leading a meeting or telling a story or even writing a book of don’t waste that initial moment.
凯蒂·泰勒(00:37:17)我很喜欢这个例子，第45页中间的故事。我都听到了，你得把它往前拉。从我自己的写作过程中我知道这是我经常和客户谈论的东西，如果你经常不知道你需要说的第一件事，直到你写了45页或者至少几段。就像，通常情况下，结论需要成为一切的开始以及写作和思想领导的递归性质。我们只是认为它回到我们的建议关于代表真的不只是带走傻逼初稿,你知道的,是让自己好傻逼初稿,但你必须愿意把众议员和一个很好的策略,你可能会说最聪明、最有趣的,最让人惊讶的事情快结束了。
Ryan Hawk.(00:38:15)在写作时，你必须在一点点热身。达到好东西需要一些时间。我们不是让我们说你是那些真正良好的外星人之一，这不是我。需要一些时间来实现它。
凯蒂·泰勒[00:38:26]是的,当然。瑞恩，非常感谢你上播客。如果你被今天的对话所鼓舞，你一定要看看这本书。欢迎收看《管理与瑞安秀学习领袖》播客。瑞恩，非常感谢你。人们在哪里可以找到你?
Ryan Hawk.(00:38:43)感谢您的款待。凯蒂很高兴在我的网站上与你交谈。有几乎所有的学习路线，或者如果你碰巧在手机上听，你可以将学习者发短到四个，四到两个到这些学习者，这四个两到两个。你几乎得到了我的所有东西。我们会确保你也得到这种方式。
凯蒂·泰勒[00:39:01]太棒了。瑞恩，非常感谢你上播客。
Ryan Hawk.[00:39:04]谢谢，凯蒂。欣赏它。
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